Turn your Circular Saw into a Track Saw Hot

The track based circular saw scene should be interesting now that Dewalt and Makita are getting in the game. I think we'll be seeing a lot more of them once Joe six pack can pick them up at the big box.

Surprised no one has compared this to the Festool yet

Re:I would be happy to do a comparison.
--------------------------------------------------
Just ask which one is better, on some of the other forums, like sawmill creek, woodnet, or jlc.

Great System!! For me It has replaced 3 unisaws, A panel saw and an overarm pen router. It is much easier to use than a traditional table saw and also much safer. It requires a lot less effort to process wood with this system.

Do the math before you buy the EZ smart guide. I was looking into one but when you add in a the price of a good saw to go with it you are in the $400 range. At the point to me it was not worth it. Sure you could use a saw you already have but I don't want to be re-adjusting my saw all the time.

Doesn't look like it would allow the saw to plunge or keep the material from splintering. Stop being cheap and get the real thing.

Both festool and Dewalt are taking ideas from ez-smart.
The ez system is way ahead in design and innovation.
Visit the Festool forum and the ez smart forum.
From SMC forum:
Demo'd both Festool saws last night. I have added some comments to my table. If I did not know the pricetag I would have liked the saws. But, when I compare a $500 & $600 saw to a $300 saw (EZ makita 500 I expect it to be a clear winner across the board. In my opinion it did not.

| Item_______ | EZ___________________ | Festool_________________ |
| Rails_______ | Ridgid rail______________| Flexible_________________ |
| Rail connector| mechanically sound_____| weak to twist, bow over len |
| Rail splinter ct| In slot_______________ | Double sided tape________ |
| Clamps_____ | Good, close to cut edge_ | Clamp to matl is too far*2_ |
| Saw_______ |Base on circular_________ | Purpose built rail saws____ |
| Saw operat_ | Std saw_______________ | Must hold plunge depth__ |
| Saw safety_ | Brake_________________ | Riving knife, really like it___ |
| Saw noise__ | Varies with saw_________ | Pretty good in my opinion_ |
| Resale_____ | Good with lifetime support_ | Great, but no upgrades__ |
| Table system| Bridge_________________ | MFT__________________ |
| Table setup | Std config good size______ | Small for larger casework |
| Table ridgid | B300 looks solid__________ | Did not stay square*1___|
| Table options| Lots of ideas, std sizes___ | another MFT (proprietary) |
| Dust collect | Very good with front port_ | Good, but not impressed*3 |

*1 I messed with the rail height adjustment and could move the rail left or right when changing heights. This puts the 90 degree fence out of square.
*2 There might be other standard offerings for clamps that I am not aware of.
*3 I made some custom 'EZ modifications' to my 6 1/2" circular saw and its dust collection is already better than the Festool. When starting the F saw it blows out a big puff of dust and there are splinters thrown off the front of the saw while it is cutting down the rail. There was also a huge cloud when finishing the cut, but This would go away with some backer material. All in all I was hoping for something better for the price.

Keep in mind that he reviewer is a proud owner of other Festool tools. Same with other posters.

The ez system offers a challenge, once a year, to all tools and track systems. Wondering why nobody is taking the challenge ????????????????????????

I work for eurekazone and I can't see how people can compare without any knowledge.
The only thing I see is a non stop assault against eurekazone by "festhooligans"

Do the math and see how the entire product line of Festool was designed to suck your money. Take a look at all the "sponsored" reviews of festool.

Here is a good example.
Non self aligning tracks.
..to force you buying the long tracks for $300.00
Non narrow clamping ability.
...to force you buying the MFT-3 -4 and 5.
Not enough capacity on the MFT's.
To force you buying the new and best dangerous tool.
A circular saw upside down on the MFT.

Now, take a look at all the reviews again.
With the MFT you don't need a tablesaw....
Do the math again and again.
Spend $15,000 in Festool equipments
to use a CS upside down?

Eurekazone on the other hand is committed to safety and
the Dead Wood Concept. The first system that allows the user "not to use a dangerous tool"

Do the math and if you're trying to help festool in order to keep the resale value of your tools and your buying decision safe...just tell them to copy more stuff from eurekazone.

Re:

Both festool and Dewalt are taking ideas from ez-smart.
The ez system is way ahead in design and innovation.

Was not Festool the first to market the track saw in 1964 Who is coping who?

The Festool saw is a complete system, the EZ-Smart is a tool accessory

Re; the Rails, Sometimes a little flex allows you to cut a board that is not entirely well supported (like on saw horses) or is not otherwise completely flat. And hey, at least Festool offers long rails, not just one size that you Have to join together to get a long rail.

Re:

Do the math and see how the entire product line of Festool was designed to suck your money.

Most people who buy Festool are more concerned about quality than money. Unlike the Eureka Freaks who continually proclaim how cheap their system is.

I have nothing against either system they both have their strengths and weaknesses. Just some people who are a little over enthusiastic in their putting down of the opposition.

RE:Most people who buy Festool are more concerned about quality than money. Unlike the Eureka Freaks who continually proclaim how cheap their system is.

Not really.
All ez tools are unique and patent pending or patented.
Most of ez tools are more expensive than the lesser quality festool tools.

Take the Smart router kit.$150.00 vs $55.00?
The ez PBB. $1200.00 vs $550.00-600.00?


I have nothing against either system they both have their strengths and weaknesses. Just some people who are a little over enthusiastic in their putting down of the opposition.


The trademark of festool marketing.
Superior- German- don't ask any questions...
until a small US company force them to make a better product and stop the superiority game.

The Festool saw is a complete system, the EZ-Smart is a tool accessory.

They pay you to say that or you can draw your own conclusions? The ez is a complete system with solutions to problems that have been around for many years.
The smart clamping system allows the user ( the freaks)to clamp and split in half the narrowest piece of wood. On the other hand, the festool system have no answers and they make adapters to use your cs saw upside down. After they promised you that you can eliminate the need for a dangerous tool, they sell you the most dangerous tool ever. They hire people with high communication skills to convey that and they pay for free vacations to many ( if not all) woodworking magazines editors. Where have you been?
Take a look at the wood shop demos and the statements from their pro-writers.
Rick C.( works for festool)and takes apart tools from Dewalt to make his point that Dewalt saws are defective.
The entire festool product line is defective by design.
They force the user to buy a long guide rail because the small rails are designed NOT to self align
They force the user to buy the right blades because the saw was designed with less power and you need 10 blades to cut all types of materials.
They force the user to replace their "chip guards" because their blades are designed with different kerf.
They advertise the superior depth of cut but hide the capability of their underpowered motor.
I can go on and on and prove to you that the ez "freaks" don't like to go with the flow and they demand solutions and not BS marketing.
And they have found a company that provides just that.
Do you know of any company with free lifetime upgrade policy? If we make a better tool you can replace your old one for free.

About your comment for flexible rails.
A rail that bends to conform with the surface of the wood gives you a bend cut / binding + kickbacks.
BUT WAIT:
We sell rail stops to prevent the tool from kicking back.
And please, don't start your cut with a plunge. This is dangerous.

Next time you talk about the ez freaks, please post few facts. Like I did.


Re; the Rails, Sometimes a little flex allows you to cut a board that is not entirely well supported (like on saw horses) or is not otherwise completely flat. And hey, at least Festool offers long rails, not just one size that you Have to join together to get a long rail.

Ez offers rails up to 20'-00" but we suggest to use smaller self aligning tracks. ( another innovation and patent pending product)

Have fun and think why your rails are designed not to self align. After you take the F-plunge there is no way out. You're forced to support your buying decision and attack the "freaks".

Human nature at it's finest and Festool must have some good brain-washers.

Re:

ll ez tools are unique and patent pending or patented.
Most of ez tools are more expensive than the lesser quality festool tools

The Festools patents have run out, that is the reason that we have any competing track saws at all.

Re:

The Festool saw is a complete system, the EZ-Smart is a tool accessory.

They pay you to say that or you can draw your own conclusions?

I draw my own conclusions from obvious information.
Using only what is manufactured by Eurekazone how much sawing am I really going to get done.?
Where as with Festool I can even saw without a guide rail, and pick up the dust to boot. Heck, they even make there own blades.
Re:

The entire festool product line is defective by design.
They force the user to buy a long guide rail because the small rails are designed NOT to self align

The rails can be aligned it is not really the big deal you make it out to be.

They force the user to buy the right blades because the saw was designed with less power and you need 10 blades to cut all types of materials.

No matter the saw, you Should always match the blade to the material. I have never felt my (TS 55) Festool to be underpowered for what I use it for. I believe it is a match for any other 6 1/2" saw

They force the user to replace their "chip guards" because their blades are designed with different kerf.

Then why does Eurekazone offer 12 packs of their chip guards?
Repalcemnt chip guards

Do you know of any company with free lifetime upgrade policy? If we make a better tool you can replace your old one for free.

And how much longer do you think Eurekazone will be around, especially with the new competition from Dewalt and Makita?

A rail that bends to conform with the surface of the wood gives you a bend cut / binding + kickbacks.

The riving knife eliminates most binding/kickback problems.
I don't believe your familiar with the Mafell KSP 40 Flexistem from what I know of, seems to work quite well.

And please, don't start your cut with a plunge. This is dangerous. /quote]
Agreed on the danger, though, suppose you have to start with a plunge, say to replace a piece of laminate flooring, which is safer? A saw designed to plunge, that you can keep both hands on or one that you have to lever into the cut while holding or pinning the blade guard open?

Ez offers rails up to 20'-00" but we suggest to use smaller self aligning tracks. ( another innovation and patent pending product)

Yes, the do seem to offer long guide rails,my bad, I haven't check the Eurekazone website in a while, It is a nice upgrade since my last visit, when it was a little more chaotic. It is actually easy to navigate now.
The longest rail I see offered is 106" (8 ft.) while Festool offers 197" (16 ft.)

Have fun and think why your rails are designed not to self align.

Again, it is not the big deal you make it out to be, and I have heard of some Eurakazone rails not being all that aligned.
I'll think about it while your setting up your saw to work on the Smart-base, retro fitting a dust port, and looking for a way to adjust the speed on your saw

Yes, the do seem to offer long guide rails,my bad, I haven't check the Eurekazone website in a while, It is a nice upgrade since my last visit, when it was a little more chaotic. It is actually easy to navigate now.
The longest rail I see offered is 106" (8 ft.) while Festool offers 197" (16 ft.)

And how much longer do you think Eurekazone will be around, especially with the new competition from Dewalt and Makita?

The more the better for us.You know what they say.
Competition is good for ALL of us.
Our best customers are Festool and now Dewalt and Makita ownes that need more solutions, ease, speed and accuracy.

This is why we just opened a new forum that is going to be open to all users and even other manufactures.
tracksaws.com or tracksaw.com
Unlike the festool policy: ( Not comparisons allowed on this forum except if you have something bad to say against the ez guys and tools.

Have fum.


Thanks and visit the site more offen.
A whole new site is ready but we wait for the depute of the SBB. ( super power bench) Few more days.
The connection system of the ez tracks is patented.
Actually patent penting Soon we will receive the second patent. Our extrusions are made in US with double the wall thickness of any other track. Dovetailed and double walls with stabilizing channels and many features like: Double clamping tracks and two directional cutting. ( dewalt)?
There is no need to buy long rails do to perfect self aligning design. We put the money on the aluminum to make it durable and to withstand UPS and the job sites.
Your guide rail on the other hand was strap to a piece of plywood to keep it safe at shipping.

Have fun and think why your rails are designed not to self align.


Again, it is not the big deal you make it out to be, and I have heard of some Eurakazone rails not being all that aligned.
I'll think about it while your setting up your saw to work on the Smart-base, retro fitting a dust port, and looking for a way to adjust the speed on your saw smilies/grin.gif


There is always exceptions to any rule.
Once or twice a year we have few rails that they don't self align for many reasons. 99% the problem is solved over the phone.
The other 1% who knows? Maybe Festool trolls or bad connectors/rails.
Please, visit the FOG (Festool forum) and read all the answers solutions given by the Festool agents.
Buy the long rails and be happy. Everybody wins with buying solutions to fix a well hidden problem.
Everybody except the smart customer.
Please, don't tell me that a non self aligning and flimsy rail is not really a problem.
I understand that you need to support your tools for many reasons BUT please, let's be honest here.

And how much longer do you think Eurekazone will be around, especially with the new competition from Dewalt and Makita?

I noticed that people are talking more about the track saw movement without the usual F Vs E "fights'that was always started by the F-Gang.


Now that Dewalt and Makita are marketing the antikickback feature better plunge systems, more powerful motors on their saws/rails, everybody agrees that the Festool haves a problem with the plunge saw/rails design and the fact that most ( if not all) festool rails are damaged by the saw is the best guarded secret in the festool community . In the Festool owners group they call it: The initiation to the club.

The Dewalt and Makita systems are the best thing for the ez system because more people are willing to compare and talk in general without any personal attacks.
Before Dewalt and Makita, The comparison was getting personal and most people thought that the ez guys was trying to talk down the competition.

They never show the festool attacks by paid misinformers and "fanatics reviewers".
Read this thread and tell me If I'm paranoid.

http://sawmillcreek.org/showthread.php?t=20522&highlight=guided+planer

Gregg Mann, Jim Becker and the "tough guy" are festool trolls. You see how they started the historical F Vs E wars?

I know that my posting here is upsetting to some festool users and festool employees.

For many years we have to deal with this:
Dan Clark is a marketing pro, works for festool.
Here is his posting about ezsmart and eurekazone.
The problem was that we recommended the Hilti saw di to many unique and better features that this saw offered.
The Hilti E-267.

Enjoy the post and please, understand what a small company had to deal with for so many years and survived.
------------------------------------------------
The same guy was posting in EU forums telling the europeans not to buy from a small US company in case the owner of that company dies in a plane crash, they're stuck. If the CEO of festool US dies atthe same plane crash, Festool would send us another CEO from Germany.
....Why not from US? was my question beforw I was banned from that forum.
I hope that you can get a taste from history and understand why I post against our competition.
Here is the superior festool marketing dept.
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Re: Cure for a 'whimpy' TS?
« Reply #18 on: February 28, 2007, 12:20 AM »

We are the target of a guerrilla marketing campaign. The purpose of this campaign is to spread FUD - fear, uncertainty, and doubt. Is this paranoia? Nope. It's just about money.

Our "esteemed" competitor is in a bad position. He doesn't have a marketing advantage. Festool as a system makes a far superior solution. If you want the good stuff, Festool is the game. OTOH, if you want to save money, an inexpensive saw plus an inexpensive guide rail from Hartville tool is the best alternative. (That's the opinion of Fine Homebuilding, not me.)

So what does he do? He mounts a pathetic marketing campaign to discredit Festool. He sends his marketers over here with silly marketing messages to slam Festool.

A key part of that strategy is to pump up a competing saw like the Hilti. OK, it's a pretty good saw. But as part of a complete solution it's fair at best. As an inexpensive alternative, it doesn't make it

What they are doing is what all high pressure salesmen do when hyping a product which is inferior - they pump the downsides of our product and the upsides of their product. They say, it's cheaper, better, and more flexible. Unfortunately, when you closely examine their arguments, you find that they really mean "It's cheaper OR better OR more flexible!" Everything is out of context...

Unfortunately for these characters, Festoolians are a rather intelligent bunch. If you are into Festool, your analytical capacity is much higher than most. You don't accept the "common wisdom". You define your needs, evaluate the alternatives carefully, and go your own way regardless of what others say or do. Even if you buy his stuff, you do it for your reasons not his. Your "bull$hit meter is finely tuned to detect this kind of marketing silliness. That said...

I can't speak for everyone, but I believe that our strong emotional reactions to this garbage are based on his disrespect. He keeps spewing out garbage and expects me to swallow it. His marketing methods are insulting! He thinks I'm STUPID! It is an insult to my intelligence for him to treat me this way!

So in that vein, I extend my right middle finger to our esteemed competitor and say "#$%^ you and the horse you rode in on!"

Now I feel better.

Regards,

Dan.

Now that Dewalt and Makita are marketing the antikickback feature better plunge systems, more powerful motors on their saws/rails, everybody agrees that the Festool haves a problem with the plunge saw/rails design and the fact that most ( if not all) festool rails are damaged by the saw is the best guarded secret in the festool community . In the Festool owners group they call it: The initiation to the club.

Where are you getting this info from? Most of the online forums it would seem the opposite is true, Same with the magazine reviews, they all seem to prefer the Festool.

As an aside I wish they would include Mafell into the mix.

Hilti appears to have a rail also, that to me, appears a lot like the Festool. and it would appear that they no longer offer the 267-E

Hilti circular saw page

I know that my posting here is upsetting to some festool users and festool employees.

For many years we have to deal with this:
Dan Clark is a marketing pro, works for festool.
Here is his posting about ezsmart and eurekazone.
The problem was that we recommended the Hilti saw di to many unique and better features that this saw offered.
The Hilti E-267.

Enjoy the post and please, understand what a small company had to deal with for so many years and survived.

It would seem that what you complain about most loudly is what is happening on this websites, with your players reversed.

Now that Dewalt and Makita are marketing the antikickback feature better plunge systems, more powerful motors on their saws/rails, everybody agrees that the Festool haves a problem with the plunge saw/rails design and the fact that most ( if not all) festool rails are damaged by the saw is the best guarded secret in the festool community . In the Festool owners group they call it: The initiation to the club.


Where are you getting this info from? Most of the online forums it would seem the opposite is true, Same with the magazine reviews, they all seem to prefer the Festool.

You can be more specific here.
The fact is that Dewalt and Makita plunge saws offer more power and Dewalt offers better plunge design.
Dewalt rails are two directional and Makita/dewalt tracks offer antikickback features. The riving knife on guided track saws is a marketing feature and most EU manufactures don't make riving knifes for their track saws. Bosch-Metabo-Maffel-Hilti.
The Festool TS55 is underpowered and limited only to 3/4" panels and softwoods...except if you buy more blades to be able to cut some hardwoods.
Most F-Users are forced to buy the larger saw with more power. Visit the festool forum and you can see for yourself.
Never mind the reviews by editors that received free tickets and gifts and who knows what else for a nice trip to festool factory/ eu vacation.

As an aside I wish they would include Mafell into the mix.

All reviews that I know off are incomplete to say the least. They do reviews to get the advertising dollars and they make sure to review only the features of the choosen one while some times ignoring the entire
design/features of the other(s)


Hilti appears to have a rail also, that to me, appears a lot like the Festool. and it would appear that they no longer offer the 267-E smilies/sad.gif

The E-267 was one of the best saws and I think ( not sure) that something is going on here.
Why take of the market a saw with great features and potential?

The new Makita MGA's are the best saws in the market today. Non front plunghing saws that is much better for use on the tracks and the same time you can use the same saws off the track.
Milwaukee, Dewalt, PC mag 325, the new Hitachi Pro and few others are much better than "plunge only" saws.
This is why we liked the Hilti saw. ( E-267)
It was designed to be used on and off the rails.

Why the price of the plunge saws is high?
Marketing and marketing only.
And the strong believe of most people that you get what you paid for. If Dewalt lower the price at $250.00 they will blowout the Festool plunge saws. And they will one day. Who is not going to buy a Dewalt or Makita plunge saw for $199.00 to $250.00 on sale?

The riving knife on guided track saws is a marketing feature and most EU manufactures don't make riving knifes for
their track saws. Bosch-Metabo-Maffel-Hilti

Mafell does have a Riving knife on there track saw and on their larger saws
http://www.mafell.com/produkte...300_i.html

Although it would seem it is lacking on their newest offering.

Hilti has one on their WSC 255-KE
http://www.hilti.com/holcom/mo...3&fview=1
also on their 265-KE and WSC 85. Their WSC 7.25-S which is also equipt to ride the rail appears to be without the knife.

Metabo's KS 66 and 68 both have riving knives
http://www.metabo.co.uk/KS-66-...228.0.html
You are correct that Bosch does not have a riving knife, 1 right out of four.

Learn something new every day, I didn't realize that both Metabo and Bosch offer guide rails.
How long until Skil, Ryobi, and Rigid offer one as well?

The Festool TS55 is underpowered and limited only to 3/4" panels and softwoods...except if you buy more blades to be able to cut some hardwoods.

I've never experienced any problem cutting any material, hard or soft woods with my saw. I have not been limited to cutting 3/4 inch panels with my Festool. The TS55 works well for cutting to its max depth of cut. Granted it's no Skil wormdrive in terms of power but it does have enough to get the job done. I use many different blades on ALL my saw for doing differing cuts in different materials, Ripping vs. crosscutting for one. I don't remember which blade came stock on my TS 55 but I seem to recall it worked OK for ripping 4/4 white oak right out of the box, and it worked fine for ply.

The new Makita MGA's are the best saws in the market today. Non front plunghing saws that is much better for use on the tracks and the same time you can use the same saws off the track.
Milwaukee, Dewalt, PC mag 325, the new Hitachi Pro and few others are much better than "plunge only" saws.
This is why we liked the Hilti saw. ( E-267)
It was designed to be used on and off the rails.

Which is the best saw, is to broad a topic, best saw for what? Framing, cutting fiber cement, working with laminate flooring. Makitas MGA 5007 is, from what I know of it, a decent sidewinder. I doubt that it has the dust collection capability of a plunge saw.
The Hilti 267-E works well on Festools rails(without having to resort to a smart base) from what I hear. although you do have to deal with the blade guard.

I've never experienced any problem cutting any material, hard or soft woods with my saw. I have not been limited to cutting 3/4 inch panels with my Festool. The TS55 works well for cutting to its max depth of cut.

Ok. No problemo.
Your saw must be special.
This is why we need a good site for good reviews.
Tell Festool to send a saw and two tracks to toolrank for a comparison video review.
GOOD LUCK.

Your saw must be special.

Yeah, It's got "superior German engineering"

No seriously, Even an EZ-Smart owning blogger came to the conclusion that The Festool was better

Tool Crib's Track Saw Smackdown

Fine Homebuilding agrees

I seem to recall Wood magazine did a review and concluded the same also. Sorry I can't cite a reference.

[I seem to recall Wood magazine did a review and concluded the same also. Sorry I can't cite a reference.

It's in the September Wood Magazine

Festool won, Dewalt and Makita are underpowered, Makita to the point that it slowed down and burned wood when cutting hardwood.

Guys. FHB magazine voted the ez smart "best in antichip protection" Wood magazine voted the router kit from eurekazone "Top Tool" with the most versatile router kit and the best connection system ( self aligning )TOH voted the ez system "Best tool of the year" ( Few years back)
Woodsmith did a review and the results was:
At first the ez looks like an edge guide...the ez system is a precision woodworking system.
Ez Invented the self aligning connection system.
The two sided track, The antichip on the right side of the blade and a complete antichip protection off the guide rails.
The Smart router kit is the first and only router system with X_Y_Z movements.
Why compare an industrial grade precision system to flimsy guides with no provisions for clamping narrow pieces. No provisions for repeat cuts,,( except festool that they copied ez BUT with 8" capacity VS 38" on the right and 26" VS 49" of he ez.
How about the new Ez Powerbench with the patented Bridge system? Here is few links to open your eyes and mind.
I don't think I can win a debate with people tha have no clue about the ez system.
Look at the videos on the homepage www.eurekazone.com
and visit youtube.com/eurekazone.
Do you know that eurekazone makes industrial one of a kind system for unique applications?
Comparing the festool,Dewalt and Makita tracks to the ez system shows that your knowledge of ez is what they want you to believe so you can feel good about your choice.
Now, you're defending that choice with no facts.

IF you feel that The festool Dewalt and others are up to the task, The only thing you need to do is to take the ez challenge and win the entire eurekazone company.
Do you know that eurekazone holds the annual ez challenge for 6 ears now? The best way to learn the facts is to compete on specific tasks and not what an editor wants you to believe because Your favor company is a major advertiser to his magazine that pays his bills for his family.
How can I say it the nice way without insulting you?

Take the challenge or except the facts.

About reviews.
Read between the lines and see who is advertising at the very same or next issue.
The system with the best and complete ( On and off the rails)antisplintering protection.
The only system with dovetail self aligning connectors.
The system with Universal provisions to all power tools.
The system with the only X-Y-Z router kit.
The system with the first two directional ( two sided design.
With dual tracks for many reasons and jig sliding.
The only system with re-adjustable self aligning square that users aff all tracks wished they can have in their rails. The only system designed to be upgraded without buying the same item twice.
You get the square and IF you like you add the special Handle and if you like you add the repeater arm to make a complete cabinetmaker that you can always upgraded to a complete cutting system by adding a second repeater to the other end.
How about the first ( patented) extendable smart table that you can buy just the kit to save money or the complete smart table if you don't have the time to build one. I can go on and on but this thing ( F VS F) is not about the tools any longer.
We need to take another look at the ways and means some companies operate.
Festool is very creative and they deserve credit for making you believe hat if you pay more you get the best.
They pay people to start fights vs eurekazone and control all the internet forums.
They Send editors to Germany for factory tours and family vacations.
Who pay for this?
YOU. That you're forced to repeat what Festool marketing dept is coming up.
Take another look at the FHB "REVIEW"
The "reviewer" copied word by word the festool website.
The Festool is a system....
if the festool was a system why they make and sell upside down circular saws to cut narrow pieces?
a tool that was "banned" from the market 30-40 years ago.
Or the new Pull saw. Another American invented 40 years old tool.

Some food for thought?
Take a look at the ez repeaters now festool parallel guide. At the festool forum the ez repeaters was very dangerous tool and waste of money. Something that can be done with a story stick and we dont need it......
until festool offer their version and charge twice as the ez repeaters to make you believe that you got to have this tool...even if their version in 1/2 the capacity of the ez repeaters and not as good.

Next time you talk about the ez freaks, please post few facts. Like I did

FHB magazine voted the ez smart "best in antichip protection" Wood magazine voted the router kit from eurekazone "Top Tool" with the most versatile router kit and the best connection system ( self aligning )TOH voted the ez system "Best tool of the year" ( Few years back)
Woodsmith did a review and the results was:
At first the ez looks like an edge guide...the ez system is a precision woodworking system.

How about some links or other citations? Like I've been providing in my replies.

The system with the best and complete ( On and off the rails)antisplintering protection

So how well do these antichip features work when bevel cutting?

[he system with Universal provisions to all power tools.

Then how come most of the new saws (Dewalt,Makita,Mafel,Hilti) are designed to run on the Festool track?

Why do so few (if any) retailers carry Eurekazone products?
One of the reasons that I purchased the Festool was I could buy it and other Festool accessories locally. If Eurekazone manufactures such a good product why can't I buy it locally?

Where is the EZ smart saw and dust collector? are they not part of a complete system? And what blades does Eurekazone offer?

The "reviewer" copied word by word the festool website.

Who else copies things from other forums and websites?
tracksawforum.com

Boy, this is fun, I can't wait to do this with the Dewalt vs Bosch portable table saws or Ford vs Chevy trucks

Fine Home Building asks "Is Festool worth the Money?"

Festool came in to our office last week to give us an opportunity to get up close and personal with a few of their newest tools.

Eurekazone just received a patent for this tool.
#10/176,156, Multi function woodworking guide.
The ez repeaters are covered by US and Itl patents.
All the latest inventions on tracksaws systems come from eurekazone. There is no reason to go into details here.
This is a job for patent experts.

We could choose any tool for comparison, but because Festool's latest product is a companion to the popular track-guided circular saw category, let’s focus on that

.

Ez Repeaters offer more capacity and they're solid.
Double extendable with 38" capacity on the right and 50" on the left.

The new Parallel Guide is basically a set of rails, each with an adjustable stop, that attach perpendicular to your existing Festool circular saw rail. The sole purpose of the Parallel Guide? To allow you to make repeatable rip cuts; something that was a major downfall of the TS saws and guide system before now.

FHB knows about the ez repeaters for 5 years now.

This setup will allow Festool Fanatics to use their TS 55 or TS 75 circular saw to make identical rip cuts as wide as 25 19/32”, or as narrow as 1/16” (using the Extender). The setup is a bit cumbersome, and it lacks some of the highly-refined fit and finish that I’ve come to expect from Festool products, but it definitely works.

Not as easy as the original. Do you know that the ez repeaters was redesigned 6 times in one month because the users of the ez system have a direct communication line with the inventor-owner? Do you know that the owner of eurekazone was a carpenter/builder/cabinetmaker?

$325.00 for a system copied from eurekazone?
I guess the charge so much because they have to pay the editors to lie. Don't you see that?

So, the new Parallel Guide Set sells for $325. Combine that with a TS 55 saw ($500), and a 106” track ($260), and the grand total for the Festool setup is $1,085. It’s hard not to factor in a Festool’s durability and their use of the finest bearings, gears, motors,

and ergonomic design[/quote]…

What ergonomic design? The plunge saws are awkward to use and they jump off the rails for many reasons.
Thhis is why Makita and Dewalt copied the ez system.
To solve the major problem of the plunge saws.
The Dewalt and Makita track offers antikickback provisions. Another ez claim from eurekazone patents.

What else Dewalt did to make a better system?
They copied the major design of the ez track. Bi-directional. Why? You can cut on both sides of the rail and you can use both hands. This is ergonomically design tool and not the one sided 40 years old track systems. Think again.
Festool is copying the ez system in order to compete with Dewalt that copies the ez system in order to compete with festool and Makita.

…but what do you think? Is Festool coming close to replacing the table saw altogether?

Only if they stop making the same tracks without the strength and multi tracks dovetailed tracks...
Like the ez.


It is sad to say the least to continue talking without looking at the facts and give some credit where credit is due.
The good news is the eurekazone is getting stronger and more popular every day.
The slow pace is good for a small company and at the end, all the misinformers and Fanatics are good for eurekazone. Imagine if they true was told.
Eurekazone made woodworking safe with the Dead Wood Concept. A new way to work safer-faster and smarter than ever before.

The fact that the big companies are copying the ez system is a good thing for all of us.
Free marketing for the track saw and the ez Dead wood concept. Because in the future we will see some amazing stuff by all companies...copied after ez.

Funny how things work.

Do you know that the ez repeaters was redesigned 6 times in one month because the users of the ez system have a direct communication line with the inventor-owner?

So, the other companies get theirs right the first time, Eurekazone takes six tries.

Do you know that the owner of eurekazone was a carpenter/builder/cabinetmaker?

Yes, I read a few interviews

$325.00 for a system copied from eurekazone?
I guess the charge so much because they have to pay the editors to lie. Don't you see that?

And I guess that Mercedes Benz can get more money for their cars than Chevrolet can because they pay off the auto magazine editors.
Maybe a quick study of Supply and Demand may shed some light on the cost difference. After that you may want to look into how the Exchange Rate affects prices.

What ergonomic design? The plunge saws are awkward to use and they jump off the rails for many reasons.
Thhis is why Makita and Dewalt copied the ez system.
To solve the major problem of the plunge saws.
The Dewalt and Makita track offers antikickback provisions. Another ez claim from eurekazone patents.

I don't find the Festool to be hard or uncomfortable to use at all, Yes there is a slight learning curve to get used to having to plunge a saw, if your used to a regular sidewinder, but after a few cuts it becomes second nature. Where as with the Eurakazone you are entirely reliant on the saw manufactures to design an ergonomic saw, Not Eurekazone.
If I'm not mistaken the Festool and Makita share a similar design in anti kickback system. I'm not familiar at all with Eurekazone's anti kickback system.

hat else Dewalt did to make a better system?
They copied the major design of the ez track. Bi-directional. Why? You can cut on both sides of the rail and you can use both hands. This is ergonomically design tool and not the one sided 40 years old track systems. Think again.
Festool is copying the ez system in order to compete with Dewalt that copies the ez system in order to compete with festool and Makita.

From what I gather from reading the reviews online, is that the Dewalt is hard if not impossible to plunge with one hand.

Festools 40 year old system. If it's not broken why fix it?
We still use saws made in the same basic configurations for the last what, sixty-eighty years?

he slow pace is good for a small company and at the end, all the misinformers and Fanatics are good for eurekazone. Imagine if they true was told.
Eurekazone made woodworking safe with the Dead Wood Concept. A new way to work safer-faster and smarter than ever before.

Once again, Who made the first track saws?

This is why Makita and Dewalt copied the ez system.

You mean by making sure their saws work on the Festool rails?

So, the other companies get theirs right the first time, Eurekazone takes six tries.

The reviews of the festool copy are not very good.
But the F-users have no choice.

A small company with an open minded owner ( carpenter )
reacts very fast to customer feedback and wishes.
The new ez repeaters offer 5-6 times more the capacity
(of the festool copy) on the right side of the blade and 50" on the left vs 26" of the F.
Yet, the cost is less and the stability is greater.
Here is the good part. Eurekazone offer free upgrades.
If eurekazone or a customer comes with a better idea.
Eurekazone takes back or upgrades your older version
FOR FREE. Try this with another company.

And I guess that Mercedes Benz can get more money for their cars than Chevrolet can because they pay off the auto magazine editors.
Maybe a quick study of Supply and Demand may shed some light on the cost difference. After that you may want to look into how the Exchange Rate affects prices.

The demand is created with peer pressure and paid reviews. Look at the Festool reviewers and associates.
After that, the club mentality takes over.

Ebay offered ( Via live.com) 20% cashback.
Festool ordered all their dealers to stop selling in ebay while eurekazone offered links and posted many items for their customers to save money.
Price protection and control that runs very close to a crime. Do you know that Festool Australia founded guilty
for price fixing? Do you know that many festool owners was very upset and vocal with the idea of festool lowering heir prices?
Why? The answer is simple. After you spend a fortune you have to protect your investment.

I don't find the Festool to be hard or uncomfortable to use at all, Yes there is a slight learning curve to get used to having to plunge a saw, if your used to a regular sidewinder, but after a few cuts it becomes second nature. Where as with the Eurakazone you are entirely reliant on the saw manufactures to design an ergonomic saw, Not Eurekazone.
If I'm not mistaken the Festool and Makita share a similar design in anti kickback system. I'm not familiar at all with Eurekazone's anti kickback system.

All front plunge saws are awkward to use.
The blade engages the wood in a negative way.
The rear plungh saws are very safe due to positive blade rotation. The blade pushes the wood under the track and not away from it.
To give you a better idea: How about using a plunge router without locking the depth lever?
Same problem.

Look at the center dovetailed track on the ez rails and the limit stops.The original SRK was captive.
Any tool can be captive on the ez rails. Look at the details.

We still use saws made in the same basic configurations for the last what, sixty-eighty years?

Time for some new designs? This is why woodworking is the left behind industry in innovations. The only exception is sawstop, ez-smart, Kreg jig and few small companies. The big companies are after the numbers.

Once again, Who made the first track saws?

Do a search on the patent office and you may find many applications before festool.
My grand father use a shooting board long before Festool.

Who invented the repeaters? A tracksaw without a build in positioning system is nothing but a shooting board.

Do a search on the Festool owners group and you may find many remarks about festool users asking the company to copy all the eurekazone inventions.
Whatever it takes. Happens all the time.

The good thing for you is that your system works better now...thanks to a carpenter.
Who knows? One day you may help eurekazone with patent royalties?

A small company with an open minded owner ( carpenter )
reacts very fast to customer feedback and wishes.
The new ez repeaters offer 5-6 times more the capacity
(of the festool copy) on the right side of the blade and 50" on the left vs 26" of the F.
Yet, the cost is less and the stability is greater.
Here is the good part. Eurekazone offer free upgrades.
If eurekazone or a customer comes with a better idea.
Eurekazone takes back or upgrades your older version
FOR FREE. Try this with another company.

Microsoft vs Linux. To a T, yet which has dominant market share?

The demand is created with peer pressure and paid reviews. Look at the Festool reviewers and associates.
After that, the club mentality takes over.

I disagree with both points. The demand is for a quality System(saw,vacuum,guide rail,work table,sanders,etc) that works together out of the box. And in the box (systainer) for that matter too.
As for the "paid" reviews, I've noticed that Makita and Dewalt also buy ad space in most of the magazines that reviewed the tracksaws, in some cases a lot more.

All front plunge saws are awkward to use.
The blade engages the wood in a negative way.
The rear plungh saws are very safe due to positive blade rotation. The blade pushes the wood under the track and not away from it.

Does the blade not spin the same direction for both style saws? Since they both spin in the same direction they both "push" the wood in the same way. If anything the wood would "fire" out the front of a front pivot saw and the wood would "fire" out of the front of a rear pivot saw.

Time for some new designs? This is why woodworking is the left behind industry in innovations. The only exception is sawstop, ez-smart, Kreg jig and few small companies. The big companies are after the numbers.

The next generation of wood working tools is just becoming affordable to home users, Things like the ShopBot and the Epilog Laser and Multicam
are woodworkings future. Not many seem ready to embrace CNC though.

Once again, Who made the first track saws?


Do a search on the patent office and you may find many applications before festool.
My grand father use a shooting board long before Festool.

I should have said "who first produced a track saw.

Do a search on the Festool owners group and you may find many remarks about festool users asking the company to copy all the eurekazone inventions.
Whatever it takes. Happens all the time.

If you know of any instances, why don't you post a link?

Here is a link from the Festool owners group.
http://festoolownersgroup.com/...#msg64183

About the rear and front plunge saws.
A rear plunge is positive and the teeth engages the materials in a more favorable way.
Hilti is very clear about their designs and why they don't offer Front plunge saws. You saw the quote from Hilti.
A rear plunge saw cuts into the wood while forcing the wood upwards and against the guide rail.
A front plunge saw cuts into the wood but the same time is forcing the saw upwards and the materials away from the guide rail.
Either Hilti and Eurekazone are lying or yo're correct of defending a false design.

Look at your manual. They tell you to start your cut normal and not with a plunge.
They even provide a stop now to keep the saw from jumping off the rail while plunging.
The initiation to the FOG is to cut your rails.
Do you like another link?

Makita and Dewalt tracks are marketing a much needed antikickback design. Never mind that they copied the ez patents, that is another story.

A better link?
http://festoolownersgroup.com/...#msg64183

EZ / Eurekazone - why can't it be explained?
« on: February 2, 2009, 12:56 AM »

When I started looking into all this stuff I took a long hard look at Eurekazone. They make what appears to be some pretty versatile and interesting guide rails and tables similar in function to the Festool system. Eurekazone may have some neat ideas Festool could adapt (steal, whatever - it happens all the time). Believe it or not, it would cost MORE than Festool to get a table with a guide rail saw and routing set up. However, their presentation leaves you totally confused about the tools. The website makes things 1000 times more complex than it needs to be. When you ask if you can do x, y and z, they tell you you can do everything, but never explain how or why. Their forum over at Sawmill is full of questions and complaints about this. Is there anyone here who ever used or owned both? Personally, I am totally happy with Festool.

if i tried that with my dewalt track saw, i have a feeling that a trip to the ER would ensue.

I personally own the Eurekazone SGS-100 system and the new SSRK (which was upgraded for free btw). I will say with confidence that the Eurekazone ideal of "you can do everything" is based on the fact that you pretty much are only limited by your imagination. With that said, I do not believe the system is for everyone. The Eurekazone system is a lot like building your own computer. You can buy the parts and create a CUSTOM system for your needs, or you can go big box and pick up something just like everyone else that gets the job done. Eurekazone has done a much better job over the past few years of selling a "package" but it is still an innovator's system which frankly I enjoy. People who feel that the directions are confusing or the plethora of videos and blogs about using the guide system are hard to follow should probably look at getting another tool, but personally I'm sticking with my Eurkazone system.